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Post by Until-Jean-gets-back on Nov 21, 2015 22:19:33 GMT
So Patience (fuck Patience) dropped a pretty big bomb last book, suggesting that Locke is a horcrux has a bondsmagi soul in him. And, using the ancient and secret magic of convenience, managed to convince our girl Sabs that Locke is a secret hidden bondsmagi.
Because Jean and I tend to think along the same lines, I think Patience is full of shit! What do you think, right people?
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Post by Rai on Nov 21, 2015 22:25:10 GMT
A third thing, where that thing is "We're probably not going to find out". As far as we know, Patience was the only one who actually knew anything about anything, and didn't bother sharing her findings beyond a select few. People who probably up and died, rudely. I'd imagine we'll never have a direct answer one way or another.
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Post by coincidental on Nov 21, 2015 23:46:38 GMT
I never know what to trust, because dear old Scott doesn't make it easy. Just when I'm convinced of one thing, he turns it around. So I'm still hovering on 'suspicious'... Like, maybe, maybe, Patience is not being a total bag of cats and is talking truth, or maybe she's totally bullshitting, because that happens an awful lot in this series. Or, I am inclined to believe, it'll somehow be neither one nor the other and I'll be left head-scratching in outraged delight...
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Post by Dragon on Nov 22, 2015 0:25:58 GMT
I don't want it to be true... I am therefore in denial. ~~Everything is fine and Bug is still alive~~
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Post by MsFehrwight on Nov 22, 2015 10:47:55 GMT
I'm inclined to believe she's full of shit, too – probably more because of personal preference than textual evidence (although digging that up is always fun). Also I still maintain that we don't know what she actually told Sabetha since we've got only her words that she told her the same things as Locke. And we're led to believe she wasn't telling Locke the truth either when it comes to the painting.
Argh now my head hurts so many. Damn you Lynch and your devious complexities.
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Post by dottedmelon on Nov 22, 2015 12:21:24 GMT
I remember she was called the Seamstress before being Patience. She tailored to fit. I believe the story is within the possibilities of Bondsmagi but it doesn't apply to Locke. She filled the holes in the story so it fits with Locke.
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Post by stalepeeps on Nov 22, 2015 12:25:47 GMT
I remember she was called the Seamstress before being Patience. She tailored to fit. I believe the story is within the possibilities of Bondsmagi but it doesn't apply to Locke. She filled the holes in the story so it fits with Locke. ^ This is exactly how I feel about it. Also, she's just a super mega bitch.
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zylaa
Year-Bound
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Post by zylaa on Nov 22, 2015 22:39:27 GMT
I actually think it's plausible that she's telling the truth, but I don't want it to be true. So I don't know whether to believe her or not! I feel like if she was just saying it to punish Locke (the "tailored to fit" punishment), there are a lot of easier lies to swallow and easier punishments to tailor to him.
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Post by lynkhart on Nov 23, 2015 2:29:32 GMT
I'm kind of in two minds about it really. On the one hand, we know so little about how magic works and what Bondsmagi are actually capable of, so with that in mind, it's possible she's telling the truth.
On the other hand, she hates him for what he did to her son and is playing him by using his worst fears against him - He hates bondsmagi so maybe he IS one. He loves Sabetha...but because of *other* reasons than the fact he grew up with her.
Idk, it's testament to Scott's good writing that we've got no way of knowing either way!
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Post by amnesiajack on Nov 23, 2015 2:53:17 GMT
For whatever reason I mostly trust what Patience says, but I don't trust that she was giving Locke the full story. I think she's said just enough to fuck with him, and left out enough that what she said isn't entirely accurate. Look, I sort of want to believe that he's a body-hopping, necromancing, former bondsmagi.
But to be honest, I'm not so concerned about Locke being a magi horcrux, at least for now. It'll mess with him psychologically, but it doesn't really seem to pose much threat otherwise right now as far as I can tell. Of course Scott Lynch is probably going to throw some shit his way and make it a problem, but for now I'm a lot more concerned about Patience's little prophecy.
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Muse
Year-Bound
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Post by Muse on Nov 23, 2015 10:05:14 GMT
I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss Patience, honestly, despite how I feel about her. I don't think she's 100% wrong, because the circumstances surrounding Locke's past are purposely left a mystery by Scott. I don't think he's a secret bondsmagi, tbh. I think he is tied to the bondsmagi in some way, but nothing as deep as all that. But considering the Falconer is still kicking around, we're bound to find out more in the future installments. I am personally fascinated as hell by the entire concept of the bondsmagi and their history.
If Locke is a magi horcrux I'm going to scream, however.
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Post by stalepeeps on Nov 23, 2015 11:36:34 GMT
If Falconer changes his name to Silvertongue, I'm gonna scream.
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Muse
Year-Bound
Posts: 3
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Post by Muse on Nov 24, 2015 5:23:18 GMT
If Falconer changes his name to Silvertongue, I'm gonna scream. Oooooh my gaaawwwwd. If he does that I will roll my eyes directly into space I swear.
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Post by thiefofcamorr on Jan 21, 2016 12:37:36 GMT
I think it'll be a little of column A, a little of column B... both will be kinda right, but not perfectly... and there'll be another thing to utterly blow our minds at the same time.
They all (including Scott) are like The Doctor. They liiiiie.
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Post by spider on Jan 26, 2016 19:48:53 GMT
I've just listened to the audiobook again and pondered the question of Locke's identity (1) and Patience's prophecy (2).
(1) I would say it is something in between. I think there is some kernel of "truth" in there. It would explain some oddities in Locke's personality and information known by some people. I remember being somewhat disappointed when I read the prologue some years ago when it had been previewed by Scott for the fans. I thought the whole "love-stuck" 5 year-old bit was somewhat ridiculous. How could Locke be so obsessed with Sabetha at that age? But if Locke received some aspects of Lamor Acanthus (LA)' personality, then maybe it starts making sense. That being said I don't think that Locke is a vessel for LA's "soul." I think LA is gone and Locke has none of his magical talents. But maybe Locke's got some of LA's more obsessive traits. Let's summarize what HAS TO BE true: LA existed and was a powerful mage that was dabbling with forbidden/life-changing experiments. This must be true since some magi of Foresight's faction were aware of this (see discussion with Coldmarrow). That faction also believes that Patience's story can be true. No one seems shocked; rather they are upset that they had not been told earlier. So magi (not only lay people like Locke) think that such a "transfer" could be possible. There is also the whole business with the painting. Locke looks nothing like LA but it is implied that Sabetha looks like his wife. Unless Patience had the painting forged (which is of course possible), how could we explain this? We must also think of the name. Of course, Jean told the magi the name Locke had revealed. So this one is a bit tricky. That being said, what does it change? I think it changes nothing (if Locke isn't a full recipient of LA's "soul," but simply got some of his personality traits). It is mainly a convenient plot device. In LoLL it gives Locke "immunity" against the magi (not complete but you know what I mean). It also makes Locke an odd character, always wondering about himself (and so does the reader). It also makes his story with Sabetha more complicated because it becomes what she fears (something that was forced upon them). But in the end I don't think it defines the story or Locke. Why? Because both Patience and Foresight's faction, who had the most interest in LA's story, are dead by the end of RoT. The Bondsmagi are retiring (and thus won't chase after Locke to know more about LA's experiments since they consider it forbidden). BTW that is convenient for the next book: there is a huge war coming but it will have to be done with conventional means because the magi cannot be hired any longer. Of course the exception to all this is the Falconer. He may hunt Locke down. But does he know about the story of LA? We'll probably find that out in Book 6 (from the title).
(2) "a key, a crown, a child" + death during a silver rain: that's a tricky one; it could be understood so many ways. What if the crown is not a literal crown but simply a coin? What if the child was already lost (like Bug)?
As an aside, may I say how much I despise Patience (although she's a great character). She's so hypocritical. She's toying with Locke and Jean supposedly because they maimed her son, but SHE sent him off to die in Camorr!!!
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